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Insider Daily. Two heads are better then one. Witcher 3 needs DX12 and became PC and Xbox One only?
misterxmedia
Insider: I guess the wait for a firmware update is driving the sdf crazy.... .. Gdc will see the dgpu error some what vindicated.. different term still the same philosophy :) (misterx: this picture from September 2013 AMD employer LinkedIn. Later his profile had been removed),

venberlei

I would expect a lot of slides of some very informative information that will match up with this blog and the hardwork that mrx mrc and others are putting forward. Plus demos and hardware talks.

And now to address that big elephant in the room... nobody on this blog is stupid. On the conjecture the ones that ask questions or have dug for answers. When things are not correct, that is using common sense. The ones that are fools are the people who cant see both ways and believe that 3 billion on rnd was all for nothing.. there is so much going on in regards to transitional shift moving an industry forward in technology and software is no easy feat.

The next week is going to be fun.. enjoy
:)

AMD:
2betterthan1
2betterthan1_2
Insider: The official word should be " two heads are better then one " :)

Insider: The biggest clue for you is this X!! Check out the logo for dx12 and xbox one.. dig that.. right in front of your eyes.

When cd project got there new sdk they new they had to delay witcher 3 .. cos pc and x1 demand the dx12 ... watch what is happening at e3.. boom :)

dx12
game_changer

Mistercteam: (mrX blog) already gone viral, they still ask where is 3D stacked?,we partly already uncover it
We already discuss it several weeks ago

Maybe I have to put or reposted that again

this is a summary from Side Xray that we got from XboxTurnon from chipwork (sometimes ago), then I enhanced it a bit

All explanation on Slide
It is clear it is stacked !!!



Mistercteam: DX12, new architecture, new execution model, multiple kernel
dx12_research

Mistercteam: I noticed that so many forum considered tech forum, not talk much about DX12-X1

It is different when before the console wars happen (after x1 & PS4 launch)

On those days they speculated and give a very good analysis
on upcoming DX or DX11.5 or later on

But after PS4 vs X1
it is change:
===============
i think i know why
1. Most of that site are lately bit more like N4g, neogaf, i witnessed several times, when i joined several of that forum, post some tech related to x1, and someone try to downplaying it, even said it is FUD, when MS still not stated the spec,

2. So instead doing what they usually do, they feed up into the trap that probably based on what we see on N4g or neogaf that downplaying X1 , not even try to check like they usually do, what is op/cycle, why low yield ?, why MS as software company seems unprepared ?


fast forward today
==================================
it is clear that today is something on X1, the proof is started to get inline with MrX blog, it seems they feel it , as they are the one
that ridiculated X1 as 2 ACE as DX 11.1 , then also eSRAM etc,

Then BAM MS show DX12 with X1 logo

And we know , most of the forum dont want to discuss it, as it is like slap into their faces, as they try not to discuss it

Misterx: Agree. there is still time for thous experts to admit they were wrong and don't look like low grade students after so many info available on the internet they ignored.

Mistercteam: People will still thinking that can we fit that so many ALU?

this question is understandable
we live in old paradigma, when most of us only comparing
7970 is 32 CU need > 340 mm^2

are people forgot 2 thing
1. the ALU is not the one that takes space, it is the register,SRAM
etc
2. Intel show they can fit 80 cores of Simple in order ALU, the precursor of Intel cloud chip capable to do 1.2TF at 2009 only
in area of ~ 200mm^2 at 65nm, at 28nm it is < 32 mm^2

so why not takes point 2 if we want to do many TF
remember we need register, we need something that can be programmed
it is why Intel 80 cores is not going forward at that time
as people getting difficult to program it, plus not much to
do as the limited SRAM etc


so to overcome this
SUre MS will take every step to make sure
remember this is not off the self part like Sony
this is super optimized.
1. They will use new node process --> hinted by Glofo
2. will use stacking
3. will super optimize the need of SRAM, reduce local SRAM
but make bigger 1T SRAM or eDRAM

with point 1-3, you can almost fit 2x7970 in the same area as 1x7970
not counting the cpu block, but X1 2nd layer is also multi layer
this is 10 year console remember.

There is no metric relate to closed box
first we must use standard metric like CU number ALU number etc
so better to said
that we have XX op/cycle resulted in ~ x TF
but with closed box performance we will have more power than that.

the TFlop metric will always relate to internal hardware
we must know the op/cycle first, and suprisingly
AMD slide showed 32CU = 512 op or 512 Ex unit
when PS4 known since 2012 as 192 Ex unit ---> 20 CU
X1 is 768 Ex unit active(from max 1024 Ex unit)

remember new node process, less wattage less heat
also they hinted power island --> Gated off per block
(Dark silicon)

Plus insider said the Flop is resulted from the low clock they use
on 2nd layer, as the headroom is still there.
he said, 0.45 from 100% (as usual hinted word) (misterx: 65% as he said reduced by 45%)

smash_mouth: Is this real??...

face_pet
The Crapgamer @clanMOH Follow

http://gyazo.com/28f5946a6ef96d302f5bcbf93ad0c5f9 Do you guys see this as a legit Facebook post about PS4 and Sony groups? Looks pretty legit.


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That facebook img is fake, facebook does not act like that, even when there is disgusting pics of disgusting things they just leave it be. I doubt they would act against opinions.

i can't stop laughing on this even if it is a fake. :)

maybe XII= X(xbox) I(gpu) I(second stacked gpu)
Maybe Xbox one has a twins gpus

"who cant see both ways and believe that 3 billion on rnd was all for nothing"

yeah and i can't wait ... this is huge, 3 bilions = big mega bomb

I hope that microsoft shut up everyone at E3 :)

Edited at 2014-03-17 10:09 pm (UTC)

Re: ok directx12 (Anonymous) Expand
It would be hype if Microsoft officially comes out at E3 and says they had a helping hand in leaving clues on this blog...that would shut everybody up without a doubt!!!

Ms have something in store , the question is what is it ?
Stacked chip or addon , a bunch of ALUs or even a ray tracing chip , i think now is the time MS should say something ....

Developers haven't even had a chance to use half of the tech that is there already in the xbox one, if MS does reveal more , will developers have access to this new extra power ?

What does make sense is their drivers were not ready , but ready for what ?

http://www.elotrolado.net/noticia_el-set-top-box-de-amazon-podria-ser-un-dongle-que-permitira-el-streaming-de-juegos-para-pc_23752?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Amazon console could be a dongle that streams to pc etc.

That's not make sense for me, bad idea if that is right

Game Online streaming sevices like onlive dont have future in this moment...


Nice work as always MisterX!

DollMighty8313

2014-03-17 10:52 pm (UTC)

I cannot compliment you enough for the work that you do. It will be quite awesome to finally have all these insider secrets come out as true.

While I highly doubt anyone who has smack talked you will openly eat crow we all know that much of NeoGAF and N4G will be doing just that.

Congratulations man!

GT: DOLL8313

Re: Nice work as always MisterX!

misterxmedia

2014-03-17 11:00 pm (UTC)

This place is a collective effort of all members. Don't count me only. :)

Re: Mark Witten leaving Xbox

josefajardo

2014-03-17 11:39 pm (UTC)

sad BUT congrats to his move ... Sonos are lucky to have him!

Smash to stay. It is hard to defend from SDF as i too see SDF in every provocative post.
My appologizes if Smash kicked wrong asses.

But,

1. If someone wants to sabotage posts and create an environment of chaos like on n4g or neogaf.com they should consider going elsewhere.

2. Smash please don't react much on neutral or posts without personal attacks. i try to do so to. Not everyone will be the exact same mood as we are and we must allow every good people be here even if they are not agree with everything. SDF acts with personal attacks and if someone will cross the line lets us all know with something like this "i don't like what you said" but no with "i don't like what you said, bastart!"

Mwjw don't SDF at all.

Thread deleted as it is not a pros for all of us.

I know allot of people here and across the web disagree with me for believing things on this blog. But I will just say, as a 37 year old gamer I have always gravitated towards real gaming info, based on real info on true facts.
Gaming background
1.Atari 800XL
2. 2600
3. 5200
4. atari 1020st
5. Nes (still own)
6. Super Nes (still own)
7. Jaguar
8. 3do
9. N64 (still own)
10. Ps 1
11. Dreamcast (still own)
12. PS 2
13. XBOX OG (still own w coin ops 4 2000 games)
14. Game Cube (still own)
15. XBOX 360 (still own)
16. WII (still own)
17. XBOX ONE (still)
Was an EB employee in the mid 90's at 17.
This is not new to me, misterxmedia sounds wright. and the research is sound.

Edited at 2014-03-17 11:55 pm (UTC)

Re: Consoles and info

dino_baby

2014-03-18 12:04 am (UTC)

nice to see Atari in there, first ever game I played was Up Up And Away on Atari 65XE still got it, then got a commodore 64 then went on to consoles but I loved my Amiga 500 plus.

Not sure if posted yet

HernyFood

2014-03-17 11:56 pm (UTC)

But from directx twitter

DirectX 12 ‏@DirectX12 6h
#DirectX12 at #GDC - a game changer? Ask them: http://aka.ms/dx12gdc

Re: Not sure if posted yet

mistercteam

2014-03-18 12:27 am (UTC)

good find....
sure it is a game changer, they are actively updating the twit, good

To me is a derogatory terms. Just for the new comers that come out of the woodworks everytime something big is going down for console war... in this case Dx12 and MrX viral tweets it looks like.

But please, don't use the phrase xbone. We hate it, at least some of us. And I will personally demonize you for saying it.

Thank you.

talke to my MS source played MGSGZ

dwayne2

2014-03-18 12:03 am (UTC)

Ok today I played MGSGZ on XB1 it looks exactly like a 360 game wtf man the AA is horrible on it does not look next gen at all he definitely gimped it or perhaps he is just overrated and had now idea how to properly code for XB1 or just plain ass lazy.The models I could careless for they look like plastic the textures are so last gen the grass looks like crap the rocks a jaggie mess don't know what they where thinking but dont buy this game for XB1 you will be sadly disappointed.Tuesday we all will be able to download Kinect sports rivals avatar creation tool and use it for the wave racer preseason game its a awesome feature it creates you so accurately.The DX news was slim pickings they told me that MS got crap for making the XB1 so big and that it will all make sense this week all they said was 2 is better than one and laughed saying you want to punch me huh they dont know how much will be revealed this week but it will be a game changer.They confirmed the fortzella glasses tho and said its to early for it to debut.They are excited like a little kid for info this week to get out and shut critics up..Sorry wish i could have got more

Re: talke to my MS source played MGSGZ

HernyFood

2014-03-18 12:08 am (UTC)

Well direct x twitter had this to say today

DirectX 12 ‏@DirectX12 6h
#DirectX12 at #GDC - a game changer? Ask them: http://aka.ms/dx12gdc

:)

NeoGAF reporting on PS4 "Secret Sauce" LOL

DollMighty8313

2014-03-18 12:06 am (UTC)

Found this funny. The big reveal for GDC is pointless VR headsets.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=785712

Re: NeoGAF reporting on PS4 "Secret Sauce" LOL

misterxmedia

2014-03-18 12:12 am (UTC)

So they accepted Xbox One have secret sauce?

Sonys software integration will be half finished and pain to use for developers.

Edited at 2014-03-18 12:14 am (UTC)

Marc Whitten Departs Xbox

Lee Candy

2014-03-18 12:27 am (UTC)

http://news.xbox.com/2014/03/games-marc-whitten

Marc Whitten, Chief Product Officer of Xbox, will be leaving the team to become Chief Product Officer of Sonos.

CrossfireX Graphics cards

thexfiles2099

2014-03-18 12:33 am (UTC)

Insider: The biggest clue for you is this X!! Check out the logo for dx12 and xbox one.. dig that.. right in front of your eyes.

So that means CrossfireX Graphics cards...;-)

Re: CrossfireX Graphics cards

redavuts543

2014-03-18 12:38 am (UTC)

he also said the technique (the way they draw together) is not the same as crossfire

Feel Cheated in Titanfall? Not for long...

Lee Candy

2014-03-18 12:36 am (UTC)



Marc Whitten is leaving... Very weird time to leave in my opinion. this guy was behind the xbox, xbox 360 and xbox one architect! Hopefully he's just leaving because he's done sailing the ship (GDC is where everything will be talked about)

Or the sales are lousy. So far, the xbox one is behind in sales

as usual great summary @MrX, and about upcoming DX12 , Missing spectator returned ?

mistercteam

2014-03-18 12:56 am (UTC)

I agree with insider POV, the Thuway called this blog like that, when we mostly talk with some essence backed up with some paper, or some interview, some hinted word, and try to analyze it, here we are not eat up 100% what we hear ,or what we found.

When neogaf or other, just eat up whatever presented by supposed to be their insider.



Now about upcoming DX12
it wont be just for X1, this is for PC & mobile too
but if they introduce that to take advantage DX12 efficiently
they need to use new architecture, then u know this is partly
confirmed that X1 has another layer of GPU compute (you can call it CPU or whatever)

So the super big bang will be at E3
it is not just X1
it is also probably several new hardware will be announced too

Plus on prev blog post, parasite said
this is the one that caught me "Missing spectator returned"
in my view that will be great if MS Guy or Someone
that return back to MS, when we just heard Marc is leave.
- J allard ?
- Cliff ?

Re: as usual great summary @MrX, and about upcoming DX12 , Missing spectator returned ?

dutchrogers

2014-03-18 01:51 am (UTC)

Glad you mentioned that, I wanted to follow up on that too. "missing spectators returned?"

Here is parasite's dream: "I had a dream last night that shortly after the DirectX12 presentation and and Microsoft partnership being officially declared, all our launch games started getting updates. To everones surprise, games were running at full hd and higher fps. Ask yourself this, would two 7970s have any problems hitting 1080p on launch titles?"

Now is parasite's "missing spectators returned" related to the dream or something else (similar to what MrC mentions right above my post?

It is a separate paragraph from what parasite posted unto itself:

"Missing spectators returned"

o.O

Don't think it is Cliffy, J Allard would be classic :D Funny that Jose mentioned that recently in his tweet. :D

I thought Parasite just meant that people that haven't been posting much will return once the news drops???

May be wrong though.

Parasite, what say you?

Had to share this on reddit as well :)

Panda Osito

2014-03-18 01:09 am (UTC)

http://www.reddit.com/r/xboxone/comments/20o14m/directx12/?sort=new

If you have reddit account please comment as well we would love to hear how this makes you feel :)

Re: Had to share this on reddit as well :)

kipotan

2014-03-18 01:26 am (UTC)

Who are you ? Are you serious or it's a bad joke ?

now i'm not trying to read into the x11 logo.....

angryguy77

2014-03-18 01:40 am (UTC)

But anyone notice what looks like white numerals in the x's?

Probably nothing, but insider said it's right there in front of us.

Re: now i'm not trying to read into the x11 logo.....

chanogram

2014-03-18 01:56 am (UTC)

What I notice is that the horizontal ridges on the edges where the light colors fade to black look an awful lot like side xrays of chips. Just teaching at straws here, but it looks very similar.

Seems like Noone has figured out the secret behind the logo! so il give you a hint

Panda Osito

2014-03-18 02:02 am (UTC)

I've noticed Noone has figured it out :/ so as friend of you all il give you a huge clue look at the x where the lines meet the middle oof the x no look at that side ways lol what do you seee???



SPOILER: IT'S A STACKED APU!! LOOK AT IT CAREFULLY YOU WILL SEE THE SQUARES N TILES U WILL SEE 4 OF THEM ONE TOP OF THE OTHER..
OKAY HAVE FUN.

Re: Seems like Noone has figured out the secret behind the logo! so il give you a hint

chanogram

2014-03-18 02:05 am (UTC)

Beat you to it. In a reply to post right above yours. That's the first thing I noticed that it looked like.

Okay, guys going to plead ignornace, but I don't see anything. Granted I am not tech guy, so someone is going to have to circle it with a red marker o.O





Edited at 2014-03-18 02:14 am (UTC)

My guess is when zoomed in the X is heavily layered in the center

Here is DirectX 9 logo

dutchrogers

2014-03-18 02:22 am (UTC)

I think there is nothing here. Maybe more in the two Is with those 3 symbols, but that is probably jack shit too o.O


Re: Here is DirectX 9 logo

1hardway

2014-03-18 02:26 am (UTC)

The entire X is made of stacked rectangles.....

Edited at 2014-03-18 02:26 am (UTC)

Hi Chanogram,

If you needed some things that give you proof / confidence as I'm not sure how long you have been following this blog as well as before this blog existed.

But if you look back at my history and comments on the semi-accurate forums you will notice that I was talking about the benefits of latency and I was predicting MS would implement something like 'Megatextures' etc and that has infact come to light.

What excites me is if you haven't played RAGE, DO IT, RAGE on a PC which used Mega Textures (via software) you will realise how AMAZING stuff can be made to look as well as how little processing power is required to get 60fps at 1920x1080, Rage looked amazing, however with Hardware implemented tiled resources (things like only needing to use 16MB of Graphics ram instead of 3GB....ferk...) that free's up so much bandwidth it is ridiculous. because the largest limitation for Rage was 'quickly' streaming in textures (because it was all done in software)

Rage would run at 1080p 60fps and still look stunning on a graphics card lower than 7700, add the fact that Consoles have a 'to the metal' advantage as well as all the other advantages, I am convinced that when the software catches up we are all in for a treat.

Then if you look at the research that was done (not only me, but from MisterC and others) from the start we were showing how the GPU is vastly different than the 'off the shelf parts from sony'

Even though every article and everyone else out there are treating them as the same. The fact of the die shot (which shows there is more to each CU than Sony's and the fact the architects have said 'net generation GPU' etc.

So if you go back and look at the entire history I think you will feel a lot more confident in the other things that are a possibility.

I also wonder If MS has been trolling us this entire time with a stacked SOC, I mean even on their xbox one site they have a picture of 3 layers....

http://compass.xbox.com/assets/23/44/2344ddb9-a4a7-412d-98a4-9dd28b526e44.png?n=ui-xbox-one-hardware-layers-511x563.png

..... UM guys, I have just noticed something in the link above........ it is from Xbox site (and I could be looking to much into it) but notice what they called the image.... Xbox One Hardware layers

Even to this day people are confused with the amount of esram on the die shot.

I will laugh my ass off if the CU's that have been used 'currently' for games is just on the CPU layer of the chip (as it looks like that is done to make it really powerful at compute etc.

G.

Edited at 2014-03-18 02:40 am (UTC)

That image has always made me think. All of insider's talk about it being right in front of us. Well, that image been in front of us the whole time, could it be that simple?

(Deleted comment)
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