[sticky post]Welcome note
Welcome! You've reached a place where you can read what is going on behind closed doors and know the future of the game development industry mostly from Microsoft side of things. Be informed on that topic. It is fun to read official news after. Here we discuss things that will happen in 1-3 year scope in the future. Be careful you need some time before you will realize that is all not a fake. All Insider info is under ""Insider Daily"" header. All other analysis and topics are from blog contributors.

There will be some typo mistakes as i don't have native english. Sorry me, i want to improve. that is also one of the reasons i run this blog :) Insider posts are encrypted and have no ideal English too for a reason.

How to use this site.
We don't know real dates of when Microsoft will talk about things they are working on. So yes, we often off for dates as Microsoft change plans or something new unusual happens as NDA extension for example. We don't know Microsoft market strategy from the heads of their top-3 Xbox managers.  Insider is a tech guy and always think Microsoft will show that to public as soon as developers sample stuff to other developers.

We have our lives and try to spend as little time to this blog as possible. Just to let real Xbox One fans know real truth. There is no reason for us to made info up as many think. We can understand why it is so. And we accept that because at the end everything major will be unveiled as truth. We can be wrong at some terms and sometimes at digging Insider info as he often gives tips and directions to dig only. You can trust "Insider:" only and read careful every word he says. He often says "not 100 sure", "talks i've heard" to show that is not verified peace of information but still interesting to know story circulatin inside developer community.

But the main idea will be still right. For now main idea is - Xbox One is 2014-2015 tech and is 2-3 more powerful than PS4 at minimum. Connect the dots of what Microsoft say(no it is not PR only) and what developers started to say as some NDA expires.

Be aware of lie and brainwash of Sony propaganda since 2005. They will fight till the end. Over promise and under deliver. 1.8Tf console(PS4) is still 1.8Tf console while top GPUa are 5-6TFs. They often show CGI first and downgrade later. Don't believe Sony trailers as real until actual gameplay to be seen. Sony constantly use this trick.

Also their other tricks are specific game design only PlayStation exclusives use:
- narrow corridor games with low draw distance(Uncharted, God Of War, Last of Us), That all need less power for the system to render.
- open-world games with low draw distance(InFamous).
- games with static cameras(Beyond, Heavy Rain).
- less objects and details on screen to render (GT5).

All thous tricks need 30-40% less power to render. Comparable Xbox 360 games look much better. Compare for example Uncharted which consist 95% of corridor levels and some of Halo 4 corridor levels. Night and Day.

Other tricks:
- tech demos that combines all the tricks.  Tech demos will never end to real games with such visuals in real time on PS hardware.
- cutscenes with better assets as real-time gameplay(Uncharted).

New trick invented this generation:
- make image quality lower but be sure to hit 1080p
- say it is 60fps even if it is hitted only 30% of time
- make a deal with publisher your version will be better (Witcher 3 dev confirmed there is thous type of agreements in the industry, insider told that 3 years ago)

3rd party or MS 1st party developers don't use thouse tricks as there is no need to brainwash gamers and show "superiority" of the hardware. Even on the start of Xbox One and PS4 when Microsoft DX12 is not ready and resolution is slightly better on PS4 Microsoft don't lie and brainwash. While Sony agains invented new tricks.

So if we see "actual gameplay" logo in trailer from Microsoft - it is.
If we don't see "actual gameplay" logo from Sony - it could be fake/downgraded or pre-rendered cutscene.

This E3 will be interesting to count "real" gameplay trailers from Sony.


Major posts about Xbox One tech(read everything and make your own conclusion)

List of major Insider predictions (<--- click this link )

Xbox One Stacked hardware proof
1. Did Mistercteam found the stacked die on Xbox One SOC image?(stacking proof #1)
2. Insider Daily. Driver update will bring more than 50% power. More multiple SOC evidences received (stacking proof #2).
3. Mistercteam Daily. TSV 3D stacking found on Xbox One SOC (stacking proof #3)
4. @MSFTnerd confirms Insider 2012 info about Xbox TV and ARM SoCs(stacking proof #4)
5. Someone used Microsoft's exec names to confirm Insider info and Mistercteam investigations

Inside Xbox One (2014+ tech - full HSA/DX12)
1. Insider Daily. 50% more powerful SDK for 3th parties confirmed. More than 32MB of ESRAM on the way.
2. Insider Daily. Full HSA 2014 tech is next big thing. Old 3d engines need to be re-engineered.
3. Xbox Ones hardware Tiled Resources in more detail. A huge Xbox One advantage over PS4.
4. Inside Xbox One: Using HW Tiled Resources with ESRAM in more detail. Prepare to be amazed.
5. Insider Daily. Xbox One display planes in more detail. It is like 2-3 systems in one.
6. Insider Daily. Hana2 have G-Sync like tech and Xbox One is not 1.31TF GPU
7. Insider Daily. Everyone think Xbox One GPU is 1.31TF SP. In reallity it is 2.6 TF DP
8. Insider Daily. Xbox One is 2.6TF DP GPU@853Mhz+special hardware make it 4-5TF DP for whole system
9. Mistercteam Daily. PC 2.0 aka DX12 aka full HSA in more detail or why XB1s 5TF DP will last 10 years
10 Insider & Mistercteam Daily. PC 2.0 and Xbox One are based on Microsoft E2 research project

Sony’s lie and brainwash (Eurogamer, Neogaf, n4g.com)
1. "Industry insider" CBOAT is actually neogaf.com moderator. Fraud disclosed.
2. Neogaf.com and n4g.com owned by Sony and non-Sony fans could do nothing other than ignore them
3. Insider Daily. Every company fights till the end. Now it is Sonys turn to overpromise&underdeliver
4. Sony don't afraid to lie because they already know they will fail and PS4 is their last console
5. Insider Daily. MS officialy calls Sony insiders as liers. GroupKarma finds liers are being paid.

1. Gamertags exchange.
2. Next Gen War Scores Dashboard - a key statistics about who and how are winning next gen right now (Now it is: Sony 5:3 Microsoft).
3. True history of current generation of video games 2003-2011.

Insider Daily.Microsoft have started XB1 acoustics and temperature tests before unlocking more power
Insider: A big chunk of Europe xbox division will be getting moved to xbox windows universal app and software division. So some position will be redundant. :(

I hear the boats ant sunk at crytek but some of the bloat is infected and heading to an id6 project.

The new guy wants xbox division moved away from prime Microsoft core device and rnd.. now my take on this is.. to manny cooks spoil the food. Xbox brand can sustain its momentum with out bloated core division ... I think phil is the best individual to lead the xbox division as a solo entity. There is a business fraction within ms who believe gaming is unproductive momentum for ms business enterprises. This will put the xbox division in control of xbox business. They want incubation and development in full force and this will also be a joint pc gaming segment. Unfortunately for pc gamers xbox devices are first in line. The xbox 360 forward compatibility will also be available in the next windows. Hence why tests of xbox 360 games have arrived on steam. There is early test that have happen.

There is recommended hardware for fc x360. Dx12 full gpu will allow this.. So people will make there own minds up on this as it is still some time yet. If capcom and crytek do come on board how does this drive market capacity. If the console with more 1st party win..

What is the community think do or dont.. would 343 black tusk rare capcom crytek and epic ur4.5 and a huge chunk of squire be an onslaught of first party backing. If all these companies come on board as 1st party with a new xbox division which is solely owned by Microsoft but as a residual body that is not effected by shares or corporate finance. It has free movement with out business control. Games for games on hardware for games.. one thing that I believe hurts all is suits... do people think the new ceo of sony is a hardcore gamer ? Ceo need to know there market be open to change not draconian ways. Gaming is really evolving now and xbox will really start getting momentum. Sales of xbox are different to sony. Sony include free promotional as sales. The last 2 months has been including promotional numbers 70.000 free ps4 with selected sony tv models. Ms do not include promotional give aways as sale figures. Which I wish they would. Well figures for xbox one are huge this month they can not keep up with demands.. and I will be honest I also hear the kinectless bundle has massive numbers. When halo mc collection hits this should be a killer app for this year and I dont think fh2 will out sell h2a. Intill ms have started shipping world wide then numbers are marginal. And japan has been a surprise I thought would not happen pre orders for japan are really crazy... tgs is going to put the xbox on the map. Expect rpg but no western release for a bit.

Misterx: Sounds like Xbox division had been sold...not a good feel...or maybe lost in translation...So Phil will fund itself by his own only? Where he will get money? That 20bilkion check? No hardware RnD for gfx means DX RnD come to end too? No Xbox One infinite time? Xbox One is last console?

Nnnooooooo ... xbox is still Microsoft product.. But now it has its own rights within ms.. this is a huge step forward. It put the product in the same category as windows.. ms are going to really spend big on the brand. And a true gamer will lead the business forward ... he doesn't have to get the minority of the share holders.. its is free of corporate hold..

Misterx: Oh, sorry, misunderstood your words. Interesting what others will say.

How is your summer? How is your work? Have fun or in stress?
People still wonder about how you could know that much info on hardware, tech and games. Well hope you paid well. 100k would be ace for such a complex work. What USA game devs salaries are?

You cant put a price on happiness. When I ant working I travil hobbyists is gaming / technology. . So what would you do.. thats right exactly the same thing.. of course I cant be every where. And I do have to take 3rd party info.. and that sometime can be wear the cookie crumbles :) half the time I dont put things out there.. and a few times there right.. but cut throat bloging is like a death note.. but you understanding mrx :) 100% mrc is heading its good to see others contribute rather then deter. Amazing bunch of peoples on the blog. The minority are really smart individuals.

I got told something that left me a bit confused. In regards to xbox architecture tho .. but its impossible to know with 100% input from the crew.. there are internal testing going on right now... and those testers are you people.. there doing thermal and cooling acoustics and temperature test.. maybe a few temperature test on a set few games I here forza and I also hear the beta of destiny is playing a roll. Iv been told forza 5 doesn't even get the fans going enough to be audible. It all has to do with environmental feald tests for the architecture. There testing for head room and how high temps can get and there gating of with dark silicone tech. These test have something to do with November sdk. There will be new sdk in October also which will have people smiling but November/December is the time to be ready..... gameon !!!! :)

Insider Daily. Satya Nadella impressed with Xbox One design. Phil has a huge amount of leverage now
Insider: The shack up doesn't effect the x1.. some marketing teams will be moving to other areas.. there is a few from services too. 85% are ex nokia employees. Still its never good when friends or family are made redundant. But 150000 people and only 50% of these people are contributing to the company.

Ms are not calling xbox a core product to market as the xbox one in particular is evolving. Its is still a product that is a concept. Its a function of all products hardware/software/cloud/video/

Something that is going to happen ..
Ms are going to push the x1 as an office protocol device. Skype apps and office 365.. could be a market revision ... because the core product of ms is office and os design plus cloud delivery.

What has impressed the ceo most is the design.
He understand passion of xbox fans and wants to push the device forward .. phil has a huge amount of leverage now.. there going after Sony but google and apple are moving into the console horizon and they know that this can shack up the industry. Xbox one will real evolve now .. get ready .. and game on :)

Insider: Xes closing is opening the door for accusations of c/c ..

marcberry: AMD

If you go over to AMD's GPU pages they are moving away from teraflops of GPUs. Also take a look at this:

See the HD7790 Memory Bandwidth at 96GB/s and compute units. XB1's GPU BW is 200GB system wide. So lets take that and move it up the list here:

AMD Radeon
R9 280 240 GB/s (4.1 TFLOPS google) 1792 Stream Processing Units
XB1 200 GB/s X.X TFLOPS 768 spu
R9 270X 179.2 GB/s (2.69TFLOPS google) 1280 Stream Processing Units
R9 270 179.2 GB/s
AMD Radeon
HD 7850 153.6GB/s (maximum) compute units <>
HD 7870 153.6GB/s (maximum) PS4 spec GPU 20 compute units <>
From AMD:
"GCN Architecture1
(one compute unit equals 64 stream processors)"

PS4 = CU.
XB1 = SPU.

Now we know that there is two GPUs from Boyd Multerer here:


"The GPUs are really complicated beasts this time around. In the Xbox 360 era, getting the most performance out of the GPU was all about ordering the instructions coming into your shader. It was all about hand-tweaking the order to get the maximum performance. In this era, that's important - but it's not nearly as important as getting all your data structures right so that you're getting maximum bandwidth usage across all the different buffers. So it's relatively easy to get portions of the GPU to stall. You have to have it constantly being fed."

So, with that much BW to fed the GPU, I think that the 768 SPU is 128ALU per spu that puts you right at 1536ALU, and with the 2 unused SPU it's 1792 ALU. "The GPUs are really complicated beasts~" Why? One of the GPUa are GPGPU compute only! Why so much time to get up and working right?

Go right to the bottom " Can you write a compute based Graphics?
Stat thinking about it"

IN XB1 case, it's one old school GFX 768ALU GPU with 16 ROPs and one with 768ALU only for compute based Graphics no need for ROPs. From:

Andrew Goossen: "Our philosophy is that ALU is really, really important going forward but like I said we did take a different tack on things. Again, on Xbox One our Kinect workloads are running on the GPU with asynchronous compute for all of our GPGPU workloads and we have all the requirements for efficient GPGPU in terms of fast coherent memory, we have our operating system - that takes us back to our system design. Our memory manager on game title side is completely rewritten. We did that to ensure that our virtual addressing for the CPU and GPU are actually the same when you're on that side. Keeping the virtual addresses the same for both CPU and GPU allows the GPU and CPU to share pointers. For example, a shared virtual address space along with coherent memory along with eliminating demand paging means the GPU can directly traverse CPU data structures such as linked lists."

And you thought i for got? X2 console = FM5 run on a titan black PC.

gforce1981: it also fits with the Die shot of the GPU with the 128 'little' bits that are in each CU

Srenia Ia: +1 Simple SIMD similar to arm graphics with fpga built in. A prediction (an educated guess):

Future gpu (xpu) have fpga built in or are all APU's.

I base this off of Nvidia's roadmap and wanting a huge bus to connect the gpu to the cpu. Nvidia is scared that there discrete gpu market is going to disappear. It will and change the face of pc gaming for the better.


Misterx: I think Nvidia is in panic mode now. They funded Start Citizen devs and will continue to downplay consoles. Big suprise is coming for them. Still time to buy AMD stocks.

Part 36. More HBM details - a 2014+ new memory type with huge bandwidth(500GB/s+). Inside Xbox One already from 2013.
by Srenia La

HBM running at same mhz as gpu


This shows a 1 Gig HBM version at 800 mhz at 102 GB/s bidirectional bandwidth. Same specs as pre speeded up GPU and "32 MB esram" of the One.

Its released right now. As revealed earlier there is other models in the 2 GB range at 2048 pins. Times two and we are looking around 512 GB/s bandwidth.

The ability of the fpga and gpu to be in sync with memory allows for a cache like memory. To feed the beast without stalls is a real issue that slowed previous games on the One. Game engines have to rethink the previous round robin approaches that you use with GDDR5. When everything is instant the previous game engines stall waiting where it didnt previously. You get lower performance using outdated game engines

Sony fanboys made fun of the One for being less powerful. The opposite is true and four gen boost in directx 12 is real.

PS... the 1 Gb I believe is a typo. It should read 1 GB according to all other inside docs by Hynix. Or is talking about per channel.

mark_dupree82: I was under the impression that Esram was pretty much treated as GPU cache before. But it seems this is real evidence of its cache nature. Question; when I hear that X1 GPU is 200GB/s system bandwidth, does this mean that it can capture all resources across the whole system at 200GB/s, but access resources higher internally? I'm learning.

Srenia Ia: HBM is divided into 8 channels at 128 MB each. It is further sub divided. The GPU is compute base in a 128 SIMD arrangment. The SIMD arrangement is flexible similar to the FMAC's in the AMD processors.

So local bandwidth is used. Not every process needs all the bandwidth. So indepent and local access to chucks of HBM with total bandwidth accesibility as well. A tile base memory system.

AMP C++ and Directx 12 is tile driven and the hardware reflects that.


The HBM Cache works in combination with ddr3 and WIO2. Bandwidth takes a step back to latency in the new model. The move engines support that. Memory in the right place at the right time. This allows for different processors to work on different parts of the tasks. HSA.

josefajardo: yep saw that and anand forums :)

Srenia Ia: Ill have to check that out. Seems everyone is talking about it now. Took them long enough. Lol. How many months has this site been ahead of the curve now...

analytic1: Funny you should say that , i was a member here 2009 , HMC , multi channel memory controller , Cadence , tensilica , fpga was all spoken about 2010 , even speculation intel would put a fpga on chip for server and amd will do the same for desk tops , <...>

Xbox one has something different and i can expect some tech in there that is of future values , i don't doubt peoples research , i only question what microsoft did do , i know what they could of done and what is being developed by other company's now relating to all this talk , the ram could well be HBM , but the only reason i question is , is because why put a big 32MB block , then i think maybe the reason was because HBM wasn't tried and tested in mainstream products so they took a small risk and implemented a small block inbetween the cpu as that was the only space left on chip , my thoughts about move engines are related to FPGA , cloud FPGA talks to console FPGA or move engine to move engine , because the move engine in the cloud is FPGA .....

I believe by September we will get some answers , it is better to know and be disappointed , than to not know and always wonder (took that quote for a post on facebook)

Srenia Ia: The 32 MB risk would be the direct 3D TSV between the cpu clusters. Something apple been doing for years but a risk on a big chip. 2.5D is a lot easier to implement and a lot more flexible.

September would be nice. :-) Even not MS already confirmed enough to developers that I'm satisfied. MS is brillant but does not operate in a vacumm. It'll all be revealed over time.

gforce1981: Think about it

You have the die shot of the xbox one and you can clearly see that there are 128 (of something) in each CU.

128 x 12 = 1536, however MS has stated that it can do 768 Operations per cycle.


So here is my theory

MS has stated that the GPU's are complicated beasts.

like others have indicated, 'what if' 64 out of those 128 per CU are the 'normal Graphics Processors' and of which this is what the 16 ROPS are dealing with.

Then the other 64 out of those 128 per CU are the "Compute Processors" (of which has not been used yet). Remember the AMD slide that said about writing compute code (start thinking about it)

So remember all of this talk about 'MONO driver' & 'Stereo driver'

Also the slides talking about Host / Guest.

this makes PERFECT sense as to what it could be about, and it makes perfect sense as to why the 'current' games are 'slightly' behind the PS4 in 'some' departments.

This could easily explain why there is 2 Graphics commands processors and 2 Compute command processors.

This also fits with 'ALL' of the comments years ago about the xbox one being like '2 gpus' taped together, also explains why they had dev kits that ere 2 x 7970's.

This also explains like the MS guy said about 'could anyone think of a situation which the console that 'appeared' to be weaker was in fact the faster console?

also on the hot chips slides (when others have been talking about on board memory and caches, well on the hotchips they only say 47mb of storage on chip, they don't mention cache or anything else.

I honestly think we as xbox one fans and gamers have a LOT too look forward.



mike_flash: DOOM

First quarter 2016.

Tiled Resources.
Procedural damage in enemies flesh and real time
60 frames.

XBox have an architecture specially prepared to chop everything you see in screen, not only textures.

First real battle: Megatextures Tier1 level hardware vs Tiled resources Tier3 level hardware.

Prepare to be amazed...

Bernd Neuke: Sony refuses PLR!

This is an information from a large German rental chain:

Sony withdraws at the time the PLR ​​of PS4 games.

You can still rent PS3, PS2 and Vita Games but no more PS4
They have to take all PS4 games from the shelf!

This is 4 the Players! xD

Misterx: LoL, so true about Sony PR brainwash tactiсs...

Insider Daily. Microsoft will talk more about Xbox One memory system
Insider: Now Microsoft are going to talk hardware.. finally..
But I hear its going to be memory system including sub system's cachs.. and cpu side.. they refer to the cpu as the true next generation step forward.. cloud talks will also be brought in to light but only server side.. streaming compute cals is going to happen .. the axi bridge is all cpu fpga.. dx12 stuff is in coming also.. I don't think its going to tie all the ends up. Because license agreement are moving slower. It will prove that its more powerful then thoes other guys seem to think.. rop this tops that.. is all they will have to throw around and its because there think of oldish design ... looking forward to this... :)

Slow week.. just hearing news and more rumours. ..

Destiny's beta is pre sdk. And this may not be big in Japan. Acti and sony might have bet on the wrong horse.. there is a real craving for rpg with evolved gfx and story not mmo fps. Its the reason x1 is going to be big in Japan. Devs over there are very open to friends word is spreading of a killer franchise coming. I wont make assumptions on these projects.
But ms is pouring big big yen into the region.

The capcom thing is on the tab so I have heard.. its investors monopoly now. There not doing a full purchase out right... terms are stricked.

Gamescom.. is going to be good for x1 fans.. 1 huge aaa game to be announced. That I have heard. Roumor has it .. there could be a sega game announced .. I waa told not next gen ryo .. but a blue hedgehog.. this could change to tgs.

And patents should link up where x1 internal software is evolving... hotchips also may leave more unanswered information as for what the put out.. like how ... should still be good :)

Srenia Ia: 2013 AMD is doing die stacking in the mainstream


Pg 52

"Die stacking is happening in the mainstream"

"It is happening now because we need it"

December 9th, 2013

So AMD had a product in 2013 with die stacking (HBM) that was in the mainstream (The One)... hmmm

mark_dupree82: Imagine, Stacked Ram for GPU, Tiled Resources, DX12 with dual rendering (Star Swarm Tech), and Xbox Live Compute...........I can't imagine a game possessing them all. I'll play my Xbox outside in the front naked, with extension cords giving me the reach necessary.

MrC, what level of graphics can be delivered with 680GB/s bandwidth? Avatar in real time? Still waiting to see that game AnotherTech spoke of.

I think that is why one of rumoured Xbox One names was Xbox Infinity.

Insider Daily. Sony and Microsoft both want Crytek. Sonys PS4 Linux tools lag 14 months behind
Insider: Fh2 looks better then the e3 behind closed doors now. Cars have a more reflect nature to surroundings. And seem to sit better in the environment. They had higher polygon model's. " I was told " the lights look better on cars with a stronger mirror effect and steal chrome shader technique.

From now on I will say if it was said or seen. Rather then lead information that I can not validate... lots of stuff is said that I still dont put out there. And it is easy for certain developers to change there mind if you give them a few days lead :) no boss whats a leaky boat before leaving port. So here goes ..

The source the last few days has been rampant on sony investing in crytek ... Sony are looking at any way to get tools that are heavily comput in nature and x86 optimisation. Just happens that sony can use directx associated attachments if the engine is licensed. Well cry engine is. As sony first party tool chain are way behind in development stages due to naughty dog using linux and old backend stuff to port tlu to ps4 .. they need highly advanced x86 tool chances not cell architecture tool with rappers and middle wear. So sony has made an offer.. but so have Ms.. the hardest part is unreal engine 4 debate. If ms purchase crytek what would be the point of continued support of the engine. Ms all ready have a highly advanced engine in development now. Is the I.p enough that is the question. Everybody has a different approach to what ms should do. My opinion is.. Purchase... why ? Because it is better to have multiple choice in engineering teams. Pc is also an aspect. If sony cant obtain the engine it will really put them back a good 14 months. Back end wise. I do know for fact that there is a licence agreement between ms and crytek in regard to ryse I.p I was told that this is good news for xbox fans.

So what do blog staff think do or dont.

Now rumour ms really want capcom .... its the truth .. capcom are more a console certified development house. And sony and ms are both in the middle of a mutual hand shack. A traid of respect. Its not hard to figure this out. But it does involve crytek. :)

Now inregards to architecture. Please take the time to read the last few weeks work of Mrc diagrams and information. As this information is 99% correct. The axi bridge is the key to the architecture and only a little bit of information has been shown yes hotchips 2013 / 14 are different you will see..

The clue is why have xbox architecture talks at a ray trace chip convention.. why even take the design there.. how many hot chips have had the same console architecture there year after year.. 2012 console architecture @ hot chips 2014

Misterx: Very interesting. Thanks for sharing this as usual.

I think Crytek employees should make a choose where they will evolve. OpenGL or DirectX. Seem like the future for DX is so bright with all that ray tracing capable tech so that is no brainer. Means MS offer is not highest in money.

As for MS I think that will be a lot for now to have 3 industry leading engines to support. Maybe in 4 years when they will get market share they need. 800 heads is a lot to feed.

Ms have to decide. Iv heard ms put a big number up but crytek them selves have to decide from a board prospective. I think of it two ways it stops sony from gaining ground in platform development. And they know how to make games and the engine on x1..

I think ms will go for a bail out for them .. and get exclusive right to games for pc and x1.. its deal I hope the do.. cryengine exclusive to pc/x1 .. game on :)

Part 34. Talk in general about Locality in relation with computation
by MIstercteam

Talk in general about Locality in relation with computation,

Almost every people that downplay X1 (SDF, Beyond3D some tech site etc),
said eSRAM is Scratchpad, yes they correct about that , but certainly wrong in the assumption.
Did they know scratchpad will always locate near or embedded inside ALU (Compute operation)

And lets take a look once more what is MS said about eSRAM (of course they not lying to us)
- Make everything better
- Compute task

What is sratchbyte in GCN 1.0,& Local Scratch Memory (LSM) for future GPU & various LSM type

Boom !! AMD Latest Patent, showed Computation operation in logic layer of stacked memory

"Some die-stacked memories will contain a logic layer in addition to one or more layers of DRAM (or other memory technology). This logic layer may be a discrete logic die or logic on a silicon interposer associated with a stack of memory dies. Additional circuitry/functionality is placed on the logic layer to implement functionality to perform >>>>> various computation operations. This functionality would be desired where performing the operations locally <<<< near the memory devices would allow increased performance and/or >>>> power efficiency by avoiding transmission of data across the interface to the host processor.<<<<< "

Just like i said 102 GB/s is from host
what inside is another matter
plus they try to reduce the wattage why send the data back and forth
when they can compute it locally

Infact it was very resemblance what Xbox.com Hardware layer & eSRAM Block

Plus my chasing finally found some hard evidence that AMD
said for Stacked device they will put logic layer for local compute....
so much inline !!!!


Marcberry: PS4's dark secret
So i was going over some PS4 specs and found this from DF.

"Jenner wouldn't go into details on the levels of bandwidth available for each bus owing to confidentiality agreements,"x_x

Note how DF adds in the Sony PR line of 176GB/s..... Sony has the real BW under a NDA.

"but based on our information the GPU has full access to the 176GB/s bandwidth of the PS4's GDDR5 via Garlic, while the Onion gets by with a significantly lower amount,~"

So this is a PR job....
the real BW is 135GB/s real world. Peak is 176GB/s.

page 13

Over at

"Post: 599"
His job is to shot down any good XB1 news. By the way don't try to post the Developer papers they will kick you!!!

Srenia Ia:

Intel using stacked memory as well as fpga,noc... more and more looking like xbox one soc we have been talking about. Also 500 GB bandwidth...


rizal88: no. 3 which console has it? :)

Srenia Ia: This and president of Hynix saying production was starting in 2013 for HBM in 2.5D... ah yes. (Hynix makes rest of memory in One and is partners with AMD)



Srenia Ia: http://diit.cz/clanek/amd-sestnactijadrovy-steamroller-v-planu

Nice article inline with what mrC talking about previously

rizal88: http://www.bit-tech.net/news/hardware/2012/05/09/microsoft-hmc-tech/1

Srenia Ia: http://research.microsoft.com/apps/mobile/publication.aspx?id=217166

HBM in One but same concept. Amd is with hbm, intel with hmc.

cigi_68: The acnologement at the end of the document is interesting...
We would like to thank Doug Burger and the Catapult team for their support and help with this project. We would also like to thank Adrian Macias from Altera for helping with the accumulator implementation.

We all know that catapult is allready out in public :-)

mark_dupree82: To me, I won't feed too much into Insider's predictions as much as his tech talks. His hardware specifics aren't amateur at all. It has fueled much research from MrC, Jose, Gforce, Srenia La, XboxTurnOn and others. Even if some stuff is off, much of it has led to a better understanding of X1 hardware for future use by devs.

He actually stated atleast last year that X1 has close to 1TBs stacked RAM.
Any naysayers wanna guess how? In the words of Fred Savage from MS Build 2014 "It's a huge win when u can access the ESRAM at 2-10 times system RAM". So, 68GB/s main RAM times 10 = 680GB/s ESRAM Boom! That's how u get that huge bandwidth........STACKED.

So Insider's predictions (Games and MS hardware talks) can be taken lightly, but his hardware info is actually good.

gforce1981: Notice that when the xbox one was first announced and they spoke about some of the specs it was thought that the esram was 256bit.

later on people found out (as MS released more information) that it is infact 1024 bit.

each chunk of 8mb has its own channel.

So I was wondering and thinking that it might even be possible (maybe not) that each esram chunk actually has 204gb/s.

When they use tiled resources they are only going to need 16mb's for a full HD image, that means lets say 2 out of the 4 chucks could be used for this render target.

that then leaves 2 separate channels that could be doing what ever they want with effects etc.

the other thing that is fascinating and this is inline with what MisterC has been saying is that the 'special processors' have their own bandwidth (they also have their own memory :) ).

take this for example from here http://www.wpcentral.com/xbox-one-cpu-has-power-dominate

"The graphics processing part of the chip contains fifteen special processors that can transfer data at a rate of 200GBs per second.
The audio section of the chip has two of its own dedicated cores for processing."

They don't say GPU :) , and that isn't the first time there are 2 different references of GPU + graphics processing.

Here http://www.hotchips.org/wp-content/uploads/hc_archives/hc25/HC25.10-SoC1-epub/HC25.26.121-fixed-%20XB1%2020130826gnn.pdf

Page 6, GPU & GPU MMU clients,
DX 11.1 Graphics core with customer graphics and compute command processors.

Page 3, notice how I mentioned a VERY long time ago that the image over the SOC in the picture has been photo shopped. (look at the left and right side, the strips down the side of the chip have been copied from slightly in it, you can even see the lines)

then you have the thing about the host / guest thing

we also have the extra ram that is on board the chip which the special processors can use.

but notice how everything about the xbox one has been left confusing.

even in the SOC talk at hotchips 2013 there was no mention of esram.

there are still NDA's that we know about

There is MS saying "can anyone think of a situation where the console that seemed weaker was in fact the faster system"

we have all this talk about ground breaking Tech that MS has that is only seeing the light of day as far as announcements (but they have the tech working already)

there is those things next to the CPU's that know one knows about

there is the confusion over where is all of the esram on the chip due to size etc

there is confusion over where are these over 50 other special processors.

It is exciting and frustrating at the same time :)

Game ON.

Insider Daily. New Forza Horizon 2 footage proves Xbox One is more than 1.31TF in power
Insider: Cb has multi projects in the works that he is guide on for two publishers... after diging on my end..

The apocalyptic game is early but is linked to shadow complex people.. multi platform

The others is a game for mobile devices and linked directly to unreal 4 metal...

The blue streak as rumours are .. it is V.R only game
Aimed at rift. Concept is unreal engine with sunset over drive gfx looks.. definitely unreal 4... havnt seen this three games other then concept this information came from second party who has affiliate with The house of Boss ... the key is lighting and weather.

He also has links directly with black tusk. Rod Ferguson..

Never had the chance to double check information some times you will have to understand I ether put out what was said or nothing at all.. I thought it would be fun to put it out..

As CB wants to call people out. Why doesn't he offer some help on the unreal tournament project it would
Be just as good with rifft support or mouse or controller.... rifft and morphus and F series are all in concept fase .. I dont think the market is viable for a new opening studio with just a name and an unlunched device line is going to have the numbers to float. Project guide is a very wealthy commodity. And even if Cb launched a good game for ios it would be hard to sell it on the premises of the father of gow when that is still underoath. I think a game with boat racing and some weapon play would be a cool concept as long as he calls it blue streak :)



more gifs

new footage

How that could be better than closed circuits DC while it it open world and renders so much more on screen on a supposed to be weaker hardware? :)

Misterx: You was right about FH2. New footage destroys DC in power and things it renders on screen. Looks better now for me. Looks like real life.

Well I don't worry about misinformation..it is all like a fuzzy logic. Better be informed on all talks for me and see that will up. Bad not everyone believe you. But that is their choose as there is enough proof already.  We could not care about everybody and make them believe you on their level of understanding of computer science. We  all have different level of understanding in computing.

Don't know should i make blog free from doubters or not. Too many time and energy  are being wasted on them while i don't have any time now.

BTW new forum moved to August as I need to move to new house and decided to start my own e-shop in July first(not related to games).

Misterx: There is also a group of haters work on the blog. They PM messaging and set people mind against us. They send PM messages with some out of context wrong facts, personal attacks on us and say "look he was wrong - don't go here - he is a BS lier". The more i ban thous who spread FUD over PMs and convince people forget this place the more they became active and lie about us.

Glad there is only several people got under their influence and changed their minds after they got "info" by that group of people on a mission to find people here on the back of this community by  means of lie and spreading FUD. They are not successful on that mission as majority have their own mind on how to read this blog and don't change their own mind after they receive PM forcing to do so.

Insider Daily. Capcom are asking too much money from Microsoft for their exclusives
Misterx: schemnue  creator fotos with yoshida....
Sony finaly got the deal? :)

Insider: No body got the deal "yet" so next week when photos of phil hit the net of him with yo.. I guess that means Ms brought sega.. Sega have had prototypes in different formats all based around ryo. Nothing set in stone. Carney and sega go way back.. cliffy was just f@#king with neogaf.. expect more.

Last thing I heard about any game gossip before chicken gone kill me ..

Titanfall optimisation is still going on. There definitely applying new sdk features.. there trying to apply some high level AA some servers to have better resolution test phase.. apparently the server side test are going well ... no screening tearing. And better draw distance more animations. Official word soon. Maybe blogers can test this information out.

Sniper 3 had the new sdk for week and 1080p patch.

Gear of war collection is happening.

Forza h2 has had an unlocked frame rate test.. with new sdk.. it was extremely helpful for devs. But highly unlikely to see 60fps ... surface texture scatering and environmental chrome shaders. Not seen in e3 build . Looks better and better .

Gfg next month will be x aaa retail game .. don't be surprised.

GC rumour is the first showing of new final fantasy not sure which or what.. just heard sq will have a big presentation. I couldn't question enough about it.. but they also so have a remake for tgs live.

Cliffy has been shipping around a new game.. post apocalypse game.. escape one city for the freedom of another. I got told it was looking insane gfx wise . The game transitions from 1st to 3rd to 2d ... stealth and beauti with platform elements. It just felt fresh and new.. Ms are very interested in the project.

Please not this peace of info i received 2 days before Cliffy B said this. For non-sayers :)

Insider: Finally

Capcom are asking a huge price .. astronomically.

They have 4 big projects they have presented to specify interesting partys.. resident evil. And reports are real Alices model from the movie was in the game but not playable in the presentation. The game couldn't match the original game .. maybe the movie to game can ... Some Monster Hunter futuristic phantasy star multi player game. It had free roaming with partys raiding other partys citys and good and evil could join forces to take down big bosses.

They also had a game that was the successor to dragon dogma .. up and running on pr . And its was not deep down.. they also had a fps tomb rader meets lolly pop the main character was a female space pirate.. very anime.. battles with octopus tentacle monster.. its a success to some gamecube game but different approach. All gamea looked good. There was a lot of mobile talks. And other I.p were discussed.. But the terms are only 45% of the company is available and shareholders get the minority. The terms are strange for the asking figure. It seemed more of a joint company approach. Not sure if it would be beneficial for ms to obtain that slice of pie of keep feeding projects in..

Now ryse 2 Ms have put a huge chunk of cash on the table lets see what happens. Its a gears of wars thing

gforce1981: AMD and NDA's

If the Xbox One has stuff from the up coming AMD GPU's that would explain some of the NDA's

From what we seen years ago there was something different about the Xbox one gpu's, like the multitasking.

New generation of GPU

Scratch pad memory

MS also clearly has a lot of offloading parts and accelerators that is defined by the HSA.
It was AMD that said Dx12 would be like a 4 generation leap.

Everyday we see more that puts Xbox one as the only next Gen system and everyday we get more evidence of why it was done like it was

My feeling is that because the Xbox one uses virtual machines means the devs would have to have used MS' API' and not had access to the metal,, this is why we can see constant improvements.

I feel that as they get better and better and eventually allow even closer to the metal shit is going to get even more real.

Remember the Xbox guys kept saying GPU's, which to me is talking about the AMD bit and the special processors, then later with the June SDK they said they allow 100% use of the GPU(no mention of GPU's then) which means more is coming

Keep up the good work MisterC


UPD After Cliffy B said insider is wrong on his game

Yeah yeah .. I bet he has 100 and 1 ideas right now and post apocalyptic ant one... funny how our conversation was days right before he outted yes , triumphant return to the majic world of game development. Dudehuge doesn't like to not have control over his world and I admire the man.. But deep down I bet he is smiling. I just hope he can match the glory of gow days.. cos I hear there also opening doors over at black tusk for him as a guide.. But will see .. I wouldn't snub the man... he is in my books a legend in this industry. Next time I shouldn't spoil things.

Sorry Cb :(

And to note Cb has been showing stuff behind doors.

But its not like he is going to say hell yeah... small studio big concept. And its pc apparently at this time. But next gen is on the cards.

And people can say what they want.. I am sure if you dig on your owns you will find concept art. The engine is unreal 4 he has a lot of concepts.

Take it as you will.. as your going to have to wait for a release. He does like metal on apple devices.. I know he also has a project for mobile also.. that could be alot more feather alonging..

I wonder who the publisher will be :)

Insider and Mistercteam Daily. We are close to full understanding of Xbox One real architecture
Insider: The reason phil said dx12 wont bring a massive change .. is because most devs will have been using it prior to its pc release when in regards to xbox one specific tasks.

Things take time.. new sdk just arrived full dx12 sdk wont be available till September. Its all alpha but with stereo driver.. fpga stuff dsp is also in its early stages.. Microsoft have to devs up to speed on new ways to do things... just like hardware it took time for people to show what could be done.

Misterx: Is it possible MS want Xbox One to be as low as possible?

Maybe they need change HW specs a little bit as new tech gets new revisions and they found a major flaws in design

Insider: Absolutely not... some devs only received there update this week.. gamescom will see huge positives.

Xbox one is out selling ps4 now.. seen some charts today .. the kinect bundle is selling extremely well despite the new bundle.

People just have to wait a little bit longer I know things did not go 100% to plan but I tell you this there is a reason for this . People on this blog know exactly what I am saying and so do you.. xbox one hasn't launched yet..

Insider: I see people asking what the mega ultra tone was ment to be ... I cant say now as it has only just been leaked through conversation and board meetings Remember the 3rd party studios there are many... but you keep what you kill.. or phil likes to own the I.p that Microsoft work on... 2.8 billion is the price to this address. :

Insider: http://news.xbox.com/2014/06/xbox-one-xdk-qa

This is to specific address the issue that Microsoft will not talk hardware.. well that has changed.. sdk talk will keep coming.. more and more talks and right up to tgs .. games will keep getting better and better.. and these talks will make it extremely hard for them devs to get away with not using xbox one...

I have told you mrx the console was not meant to launch till late 2014... from e3 on its going to be better and better..

Misterx: Can you check the right lines for us? mean that teach is inside xbox one http://www.hotchips.org/

Insider: Devs read the blog.. to see when things are coming... cos its taken 3 months for phil to get control of the company . Cliffy is right..

I will a sure you this amazing things are coming

Insider: I want you to understand we have a lot of people would like to see us go down.. there was more information that came before e3 which I new was lies to catch us out... that is why I posted the shenmue 3 and half life 3... these games are in dev I can asure you.. but I had to make a judgement and it worked..

Insider: I am working on a huge update of information. It is hard to explain what is going on.. the problem is trying to explain the axi bridge. Fpga programmable gate arrays. And arm co processing. Vector dsp. But there is a huge part of hot chips that was put out there but not explained. Even tho I new enough I still didn't understand how it worked on the programmable level.. there is a tone of stuff now. Slave /master ... are actually host/guest they confused the terms .. not sure why if its nda .. but

There missing blocks that connect to the axi bridge. You need to look at the shape audio block the yellow colors.... the gray blocks have nothing to do with audio other then they can process via reprogrammed logic.. its going to be very complicated to explain. But I am working and going to submit research docs diagrams that will brake this down...into manageable segments of information... there is 100% two system interconnect with x1 hardware and they are both accelerated too.. call the traditional cpu+gpu+gpugp master/host and the axi bridge slave / guest.

Forward compatibility is only possible via slave/guest hardware architecture. Same as ray tracing. This really is like a crossfire sli architecture then previously thought.. axi bridge interconnect new architecture with enhanced gpu+ cpu /gpugp / data move + esram.

The display plans there is two for gpu dual logic. And one for the snap feature which use the 4 cu on the cpu. It is also why the cpu has 4 cu's, and why the axi bridge connect directly to the master/host cpu and not the gpu... that is why the 4 cu are older simd.
And why the esram cluater is 16mb between the main/host cpu. So the dsp have access to cpu cach. main/master cpu

I will set the record straight very soon mrx :)
Would like to share information with mrc so that he can push the information even more.. nda stuff .

Insider: Mrx I will be working on a information peace over the next few days. It will touch on 90 % of x1 architecture .. and explain were the ray traciny dsp design derived from. .. its extremely complex information. But it will blow mrc away also.. :)

Insider: Its amazing how much information has been posted on the blog in the last few hours(misterx: page 3 and 4 of comments by Mistercteam in previos post).. its 99% inline .. iv spent hour going over white papers sdk information. And then boom its up... fpga asics scalable core vector.. dsp. Hmb memory cach. But like iv been saying its been right in front of your eyes...

Your biggest and most importantly clue is Axi Bridge.
Every ray tracing chip idea has this special bridge. Host guest or is it master slave :) its the future of interconnected gateways ...

Sgrt and amp c++ share similarities..

The reason why the high level engineering team for kinect voice control wont let other teams use this dsp processing reservation. Wait till the next sdk update comes around in august and September.. ant no voice ever been used on that dsp.. only yellow for audio 512 voices and dedicated plugin processing and surrounded mixing.. kinect voice commands have only ever been used via the soc within kinect the mic array.. 18 gops hhmmm how many watts even bigger clue.. dp.. specialized engines... there is even more connected at the Axi Bridge.

Its a testament to the blog how good the team is digging. You people are onto this good work mrc all most there.

That chines name @ hotchips 2014 !! Yeah you can find some much out if you digg his name. Ray trace chow. He has been involved in a team of other starting with T. Right back to 2007. 2012 ms licensed and brought them in to help design fpga axi and others. But Samsung help design so much but only through concept patients. Think what 64kb 32kb 8kb 32kb 16kb 8kb im sure you can understand scratch pad caching. Mobile rt gpu on a huge scale.. but benefits of keeping inline is less heat less power draw ...

Mrx ill do a deep dive with diagrams in my next information talk.. like I had planed but I feel mrc and others have earned the right to speak first there the ones who get put down.. remember dx12 is dead mantal opengl api this ... layered hardware .. the complexities within x1 are so hard to give the figures because it is evolving.. programmable logic is the future or fabric are they one in the same on a hardware or software side. Boom ... :)

Insider: Ryse 2 was in very early prototyping... one level .. open world ship to beach to ice mountain. I.p ant dead more on this subject @ gc, it will be addressed in some form officially. The crytek situation is hindered by the fact that unreal is coming in 2015. That is a problem and it can do rt elements. Crytek are 2016/17 for that engine update. Middle/3rd party licensees are not happy and that is why contracts got cancelled. Will ms purchase or fund other projects in the future I have heard yes. But when ms spend and invest in 2nd party or joint funding agreements they would like to obtain more leverage over these I.p's. Technology to software is evolving on the console front. And that is a burden on development studios as well.. ms have there own engine sdk and apis now. And they are heavily involved with unreal development.

Capcom would be 1st party. Crytek 2nd party. In a perfect sense. Or ms could invest 4 billion in true 1st party studio's. What do people on the blog think. Do or dont. Co's you keep what you kill this generation :)

Part 32. More details on 768 ops/cycle (768 SPU) and why there is more RAM with gigantic bantwidth needed to feed each SPU for RayTracing type of tasks. Why that RAM is already there and called HBM.
by Mistercteam

Mistercteam: Sometimes ago 2002-2005, Berkeley + Stanford try to combine SRAM/eDRAM/DRAM + ALU logic

They called it VIRAM

X360 eDRAM is same on principle
but little programmibility, only target for free AA, etc
10MB + 192 ALU in fusion

so what about stacked Memory + SRAM + Compute Cores in fusion ---> it is X1
it is why eSRAM = on MS slide = General Purpose RAM

basically we see the block as memory
but the main funtion like on X360 is more than that, not just for eDRAM they fused in 192 ALU with 10MB eDRAM

on X1 , MS further enhance it to be like for general compute too

Mistercteam: This is my assumption, after comparing so many configuration

from 768 Op/cycle = 768 SPU

192 of it are part of what we called 12-14CU but 128 ALU
there is many SPU left for spare in the future

512 of it are the nextgen part
512 x 64 KB local sram = 32768 MB
512 x 8 MB local stacked memory = 4 GB additional stacked memory unrevealed
(some indies leaked their devkit spec,stated they got 12GB, as we know devkit = retail, only the devkit is enabled some of its features)

so the eSRAM is yes = 32768, after seing the audio block = 64KB labeled esram
per SPU control 8 ALU

also Xtensa 10 (MS said Project Turn 10, 10 Forward)
is support 8 MB per SPU block + xx KB of eSRAM

this also fit with insider + Albert sometimes ago that said DDR = 272 GB/sec
as there is stacked memory too, this is for locality per SPU in tandem with eSRAM

Misterx: for thouse who need more please read Mistercteam research on page 3 and 4 to previos post.

Part 33. Now all comes full circle. Full Xbox One architecture explanation
by MIstercteam

all now inline, and fit .....
include 128 ALU
include insider said as R9 280x
include 4TB/s insider said 2012 of Oban SOC,
thats why ray tracing is possible

The Similarity of X1 Audio block with Cell SPU/SPE
also the BW of it multiply with 256 (per 16MB) or 512 (32MB) equal to ~ 4TB/s
same as insider said per 2012, thats why he said ray tracing is possible
also fit with 768 SPU distribution, and Gfx accelerator = 192-224 SPU =
12-14 Shader core

eSRAM is next next next future Viram/imagine concept
eDRAM is limited programmable on 192 ALU, X1 esram is full prgrammable
GP compute/GPGPU , esram block

Now All fit with epic Tim Sweeney
i posted below per 2012-2013,
but now fit with above slide and prev digging
also MrX insider Info.
remember 2-4TB/s is BW inside esram Block
not the BW from host to eSRAM block !!!

Misterx: MInd blown. That is really full circle where all inline and feet. Mistercream for president! That is and IBM engeener level of research. Hats off to Mistercteam for digging out insider info finally.

Insider will also create its diagrams. Hope they will be easy for non tech guys.

Made some gifs...


Community Daily. Xbox One 50MCUs are FPGA & ASIC - super fast re-programmable cores - 2015+ tech
Part 31. Xbox One 50 MCUs are FPGA & ASIC - super fast re-programmable cores - 2015+ tech

Srenia Ia; The tech inside the One is new gen. Ps4 is old gen. I see it easily not by rumors but by visually seeing it. The new tech next to the One tech. I hear it by MS saying bandwidth is around 680 Gig max on SOC verses its DDR3. I hear it by DirectX 12 on the One with ability of the SOC hardware to be programable for future changes past this version.

Cloud is real. The new tech you can see and hear currently. Its awesome tech MS brought to the table.

Insider info is great. Don't rely solely on it but research. Go past the Sony fanboy level and you'll be confindent in the One tech. The difference is apple and oranges between the two systems.

Srenia Ia; http://techreport.com/news/26656/xeon-hybrid-marries-x86-cores-with-fpga-sidekick

Ps4 is looking more dated each day. The forward thinking of MS is based on real tech that is already being used on Bing search engine. It is giving a 40 times boost in their specific algorithym. This tech is going mainstream little by little. Intel making it apart of their server line is major.

MS using fpga on the One should dispell any notion of quick releases of MS consoles as well.

josefajardo; In response to those questioning Srenia La's post above (regarding FPGA intel link)..

It's been discussed months ago that Xbox One has ASIC and FPGA ..

Numerous linkedin profiles have mentioned such just look for them..

Heres a couple from just a few quick searchs...

Saurabh Kasat
- "Working on verification and validation of XBOX one ASIC. "
- http://www.linkedin.com/in/saurabhkasat

Cary Snyder
- FPGA & ASIC bring-up, debug/stress test i.e, XBox One DDR3 & SoC
- http://www.linkedin.com/in/carydsnyder

Hsu-Kuei Lin
- Migrate XBOX RTL to 3rd party development kit through FPGA.
- http://www.linkedin.com/pub/hsu-kuei-lin/27/15/37b

Misterx: That it. Game over. Bold proof for me.

gforce1981: Guys,

I don't know why people are doubting everything MS has said.

MS has been honest, it is sony that are not.

There is stuff in the box we know that isn't being used.

We KNOW there are STILL NDA's on the xbox one.

So with Phil saying the Dx12 will make it easier for the devs, well I have sent him personal messages before and all the ones where I ask about Tech he doesn't return, where as the non tech ones he does reply.

MS have always been hiding stuff that they don't want to get out yet before they are ready, that is why there are NDAs.

SO WHY would Phil want to tell everyone that Dx12 is going to be such a game changer it is crazy.

far out people, we have heard it from devs and others saying it is a MASSIVE performance difference, It is also going to be the one that gives access to the dedicated 'over 50 other processors'

So why would Phil want to tell all of their competitors that it is going to be huge so they have nearly a full year to try to close some of the gap?

DX12 is STILL being developed, people are treating it like it is done, it is NOT done.

in 2015 we are only just going to start to see games using Tiled Resources (because the company that does Tiled Resources said games are being developed now with it and they wont be seen until 2015)

and given Dx12 is not complete (though we know the performance difference with the CPU is amazing) they are still working on the rest.

So I find it VERY hard to believe that any game actually using the full dx12 yet, because it isn't ready.

Though look at it this way.

MS have with Dx12 Shown PROOF of how such a MASSIVE difference they have been able to achieve with the CPU's (which means more CPU is available for Compute, physics, ai etc)

MS have shown with Tiled resources how Massive bandwidth isn't needed any more and can have massive detailed worlds and only need 16mb of video memory.

MS have shown with the cloud project that they can get DOUBLE the performance with specialised cores... COUGH (remember those over 50 other processors the Xbox one Has) and only use 10% MORE POWER!!!

MS have shown that with the cloud and a very tiny internet connection that the cloud can be used for offloading massive amounts of Physics, AI, and soon to be lighting.

Guys, Stop getting so upset and but hurt.

MS have not lied to us, they have given us their plans, all we need to do is enjoy the games we have until they get the software sorted out to use the xbox one the way it is meant to be used.

Far out, if people can't see how massive this is (AND the PS4 does not have any of this) then I don't know what to say.

Game ON.

Lee Candy:

FPGA, touts 20x performance boost


This new Xeon+FPGA chip will fit in the standard E5 LGA2011 socket, but the integrated FPGA will allow each chip to be customized to specific workloads. This move is almost certainly intended to make Intel-x86 a better all-round platform for a wider variety of workloads in enterprise and data center settings, and to dissuade customers from switching to GPGPU accelerators from the likes of Nvidia.

gforce1981: From your post

"Imagine if you could load a core part of a game engine into the FPGA; the physics engine perhaps, or the enemy AI. Or a core part of your PC’s operating system. That could be very cool indeed"

Funny, I have a feeling this is what MS is up too :)

Lee Candy: Yes, and seeing that Intel has made this announcement maybe some of the NDAs are going to end

Misterx: So, that is why every game have its own OS on Xbox One. Every game will program thouse 50MCU/FPGA as they need to use in rendering fixed functions. For example - ray tracing engine could be programmed to run on those super fast MCU cores.

BTW, for non sayers. Insider talks about re-programmable chips and 64 small cores inside xbox one since 2011.

The last mention is on March 11, 2014

March 11, 2014
Insider Daily. XB1 has re-programmable logic. DX12 is not final version it supports for 10 year plan

"I believe in the vision I believe in the hardware and the software. Dont think dx12 is the final update for x1.. this hardware has re program logic .. much more to come "

gforce1981: This is from the Xbox Website:


"Kareem: Developers have more choice and flexibility to manage the resources of the Xbox One to deliver bigger and richer game experiences. Previously, 10% of the GPU was reserved for system level processing which included Kinect-related skeletal tracking data. With this change, titles that are not using skeletal tracking with Kinect can choose to use that portion of the system reserve for other purposes. We have also optimized the entire system so that titles have access to 100% of the Xbox One GPU for increased resolution and graphical effects."

So he is saying 10% was reserved for 'system level processing which INCLUDED Kinect-related Tracking' - so this means not all of the 10% was for Kinect tracking.

Then he says this

"We have also optimized the entire system so that titles have access to 100% of the Xbox One GPU for increased resolution and graphical effects." - How can you have access to 100% GPU when there is still some 'system level processing', and how can a game have 100% access to the GPU if Snapping other kinect still works.

There is clearly something more to this box than we still know because what he said conflicts with the normal theory of just one GPU or something.

If a game can use 100% of the GPU, then what does the system use for snapping Skype etc?


gforce1981: Above my previous post talking about FPGA's it talks about having a chip that is programmable.

It says in that article that you can code it for anything you want.

Maybe like a GPU, or a specific task.

When I said in my previous comment about the confusion over the 100% of the GPU.

What if MS have made the core xbox stuff, apps etc, run off specific customisable FPGA or something like that? the guy did say they completely optimized the entire system.

and that would then make sense that an application could use 100% of the GPU and still have the other specific processor handle things like Skype etc?

But whats more exciting is what they said at the bottom of the article.

"Imagine if you could load a core part of a game engine into the FPGA; the physics engine perhaps, or the enemy AI. Or a core part of your PC’s operating system. That could be very cool indeed"

Funny, I have a feeling this is what MS is up too :)

gforce1981: The secret

I think this is the secret guys.

Those 'over 50 MCU's / DPU's' things.

The audio part of the xbox one which we know is meant to be more than just audio "like Charlie at semiaccurate said"

but all this talk of programmable chips and how powerful they can be.

the talk from MS how they have 15 of these chips dedicated to Graphics and Physics...

Talk of programmable chips that can be 10 - 100x faster.

Well does anyone remember this. this is proof that the xbox one has programmable chips inside of it.



This is why there are NDA's

This is game changing and why there is a delay with software.

And definitely a delay with game engines.

Game on.

OH and Don't forget this people!!!!

"These statements have are very similar to the statements begin made by several industry professionals. AMD’s Raja Khodury had this to say regarding the benefits DirectX 12 will have on Xbox One:

“And it’s not a small benefit. It’s… like getting four generations of hardware ahead with this API.”

gforce1981: Answers and Confidence what people are looking for

If you are looking for confidence in the Xbox one you should take a read of this whole article. MS knew there was going to be challenges with things like Resolution to start with (They expected this)


Boyd Multerer (The guy who basically designed the Xbox ONE SOC)

""It wasn't fun," he says. "But actually, now that I'm past it and I can look back - I think that it actually vindicates one of the strategies that we had. One of the goals was to create an architecture that can change over time, so as those changes were happening, we could roll with it without it dramatically effecting the kits we were giving to game developers." An architecture that can change... where have we heard about architectures can change :)

"The other, arguably bigger task is getting devs used to the architecture itself. Early Xbox One games struggled to hit full 1080p resolution, particularly cross-generation titles that had to run on multiple formats, the cause of which Multerer describes as "complicated".

"Part of it is the obvious one where everyone's still getting to know this hardware and they'll learn to optimise it. Part of it is less obvious, in that we focused a lot of our energy on framerate. And I think we have a consistently better framerate story that we can tell.

"On the CPU side, we really pushed how fast the central processor is running, so you'll see much smoother framerates, you'll see much less hitching on the Xbox One, and that's a big deal in these games: you really want them to be smooth.

On the number of pixels side, there's also a kind of change in the conversation - what's the right one to be focused on? Is it number of pixels or is the quality of pixels? And this gets into the way that the game engines run.

- Remember guys about having games looking better, which is what xbox games have been achieving, classic example is that murder suspect game.

"There's a whole bunch of post-effects that you can run. We do the right kinds of anti-aliasing, you can do shadow rendering and all that, and you do those things in the really, really fast RAM that's in the back of the pipeline, and you end up with an image that looks significantly better in some ways,

and it's becoming less clear whether this is a number of pixels count story or whether this is a quality of pixels story. Both matter, but it's not all about one number or the other number."

"It's not a problem Multerer expects to last; now that developers have had time to get used to the architecture, they'll be able to get more out of it."

- notice as more SDK's come out things are also getting better

"I fully expect that to happen," he says. "The GPUs are really complicated beasts this time around. In the Xbox 360 era, getting the most performance out of the GPU was all about ordering the instructions coming into your shader. It was all about hand-tweaking the order to get the maximum performance. In this era, that's important - but it's not nearly as important as getting all your data structures right so that you're getting maximum bandwidth usage across all the different buffers. So it's relatively easy to get portions of the GPU to stall. You have to have it constantly being fed." - this is what we have been hearing about these accelerated stuff, getting the right data into the right caches.

Here is some of the GOLD

"If that sounds complicated, it gets worse: getting your Xbox One game to run smoothly requires shuffling data between different components with absolute precision; even the smallest delay can hold up the entire process.

"This is a effectively a super-computer design," he says. "This is a design out of the super-computer realm. So I expect that we're going to continue to see fairly large improvements in GPU output as people really tune these data sets."

- Shuffling data between different components... you don't need that if you only have one gpu do you now :) or a clear indication he is talking about the other processors

And there is the Super-computer mention again :), why call it a design out of super computing if your peers and others can Mock you for 'off the shelf hardware".

"It isn't surprising that most publishers, running flat out to release games on every available format before Christmas, didn't have the time to sort this out. - there's them saying this would happen guys!

"Xbox One was a crazy launch. All console launches are crazy. Me and the team, we've all worked seven days a week from June until November, and we're all really tired and all the game companies; they were there too. So in a lot of cases it was "Okay, we've got to get the game running" and then there's not a whole lot of time to do the tuning." - guys, MS has been honest from the start

"Now that developers have had time to tune the big engines, like Frostbite and Unreal, to make the best use of Xbox One, things will pick up"

- Division :), looks friggn amazing.... and Unreal.... :) we haven't seen something direct from Unreal have we yet :) (to make best use of Xbox One... Things will pick up), things have been picking up guys.

On the subject of what comes over the next few years, Multerer is delighted to say that he has no idea. "The first thing I admit is "I have no clue!" We designed for that. If there are areas that we can't know, then the most important design feature you can put in is the ability to change" - Ability to change :), can't really say the same for the PS4 now can we.

Add on top of this Tiled Resources, Off loading to accelerators, Cloud Physics, AI & lighting...

It is a time to be VERY excited for the future of Xbox One and being a Gamer.

xreadmore: Remember this quote from the DayZ creator?

"I have nothing against consoles, and there's some really interesting and exciting things happening. That was one of the cool things about meeting with Microsoft," Hall told Eurogamer. "There were definitely some things they said that I'm not allowed to talk about that I was like, 'Wow! That's interesting. Why don't you tell people that?' But I guess they want to make sure everything all goes together and that."

Just to add another interesting fact....

25th of February he talks about "interesting" things at Microsoft, then March 2nd, 5 dayz later, he effectively doubles the staff working on DayZ.

Food for thought.

Anonim: I don't know why people are worrying about Phil Spencer's comments regarding DX12.

He is obviously still under NDA about this whole situation and it's clear that Microsoft will continue to troll SonyGAF for the foreseeable future.

Modifica Console Puntocom: Where is the ps4 retail serious game? lol...
Bloodborne,Driveclub,Knack = hahahaha!
Infamous Second son= ok
Little Big Planet = PS3 hahahaha
Killzone Shadown Fall= Sbadiglio yawn
Uncharted 4= 2016? 2017? mai never?
The Last Of Us Remastered = hahaha ps3 o ps4?
The order 1866= hahahaha
Rime = ok nice
PS4 = bye...

Insider Daily. Why Microsoft tell there is still NDA for "inferior" to PS4 Xbox One hardware?
Insider: Drive club liner levels no open world no environmental damage ... the road in forza horizon 2 is mapped just like the dynamic weather night and day cycle. As well as dust grass mud wood and metal grime. Look at the amount of cars. Drive club is a 10 hour game forza 120hr +.. Forza horizon 2 has been all in game some of them dc videos are replay. I know I have played both and I have seen fh2 latest build it has 50% more texture detail and sub surface scatering and dof the tree look way more textured and so do the cars.. there is a shine elerment which is missing from the e3 build. They are using the same effect in qb ... chrome sub surface. That is why dc looks a little more polished on the vehicle side of things . But dont take my word for it. Wait till gdc build your going to see the difference.

Dc is using ace full render path.. ms have only just given devs extra cu's and stereo big big difference. 2x gpu peferomance. Dual logic.

Like batman beging rendered on pc too.. drive club is very boring in regards to its aspirations people will see this.. all liner..no substance .. I still think if you have a ps4 its a no brainer.. but some of the video are replay mode forza horizon 2 replay mode is the same but its not a final representative of final game play.

Downgrades will be had...

Insider: Inregards to blog post 100% correct mkx is 1080p 60fps ... and I did leak the game before edboon had given hints ... typo. They do happen .. but it is 1080p and not 800p :)

Insider: Parasite dr3 patch delayed ..from 900 to 1080p 30 no dips 30.. not sure when the patch will land but phil is going to push for all devs to reach that level as new sdk has enough power to render ryse @1080p 60fps with ease... some games and I do mean some basic money hated sony diablo stuff will not be 1080p inless they officially get called out. But in honest d3 should be 1080p 60fps with ease. There is no exception now.. new sdk = 1080p no @#$#@$# excuses .. and that is that.

Insider: http://gamingbolt.com/sunset-overdrive-runs-at-900p30fps-on-the-xbox-one

1080p 30 locked... before sdk alot of 2nd party games were locked to 900p new update to sdk will allow more resolution and more scale. Gdc will show this

Insider: The problem with ssod is they have not used updated sdk yet to optimise or take effective use of tools The confusion is rip on this project .. the devs have stated to many people 1080p 30 locked. Iv seen the game. The 1080p 30 was devs side. This is the first time I have heard of 900p ... it does not make sense to drop the resolution when every other dev are getting resolution bump ups and better lod with sdk update. The game is hardly going gold tomorrow.

Plenty of time.. the sub hd debate is over ... I expect gdc to clear this up once and for ever. 2nd and 3rd party devs just need a bit more time to implement the new features

Insider: http://www.redgamingtech.com/inside-xbox-one-amd-microsoft-developer-day-analysis-breakdown-tech-tribunal-part-1/

Wtf honestly this has nothing to do with 16th :)
Old none nda meeting ... took there time to match up vgleaks

Insider: I had a conversation with a ps4 dev friend. I was asking him more about the jaguar cpu threading . And he said single issue 8 way memory cach read write on ps4 .. i will be going over the latest ice sdk documents in the coming hours to verify this information.

As with isca discussion about to hit the blog. I find it strange that the x1 has been dual issue with 16 way cach read write. Plus 1.75ghz cpu clock speed. There is also 4 cu 2 for each 4 core quod. Which I am lead to believe are very similar to ace cues.

So 8 threads jaguar vs custom jaguar 16 threads 4 cu ace.
20 gig buss for cpu ps4 30 gig for x1 cpu.

2 cores for both console reserved for os..
so 6 cores 6 threads for ps4 / 6 cores 12 threads for x1.

Gpu dual logic cpu dual issue. Mrc should be able to explain this more... after leaked slides head our way ... which I am a sure they will be :)

Insider: People be patient please. Trying my hardest to get you information. There is some stuff that ms ibm and amd do not want in public sectors yet. This time Nda are serious. Not just warnings but full abolished from industry. Never work again stuff and big trouble financially. This is not your typical leaked stuff.

I will tell you tho... that axi bridge is new technology. Its design to allow different computer hardware to talk to each other and there is many blocks of hardware there. Audio/ Graphics accelerated fpga technology "new" tech./ And cpu math coprocessor. There is a cluster of little dsp co process that are re programmable. This is the 50 blocks .. the esram sits on top or around these processing blocks and act as some type of heat spreading or from what I understand that is why there is more esram but the gpu can not access this extra .. it is only for these 50 blocks .. also these process can be gated off when not in use and is the main benefit of dark silicon technology. There is a 100-20watt reserved power load buit into x1 for this tech. And is designed to push gpu cpu passed what moore law has aloud. This is what all future gpu will have to reduce heat and push the gfx of the future. Every thing can be offloaded to these process 100% freeing up gpu ... more should leak out I am told control leak is coming very very soon and it is based on crackdown tech demo. And every body will think you will need external cloud to do this but you wont..

It will all come out soon more to come I need to dig deeper so that trust can be shown ..

Insider: I dont have the time to address people directly on the blog.. but Modifica Console Puntocom had some questions. And the main question sequels..

Well its been a long time since new hardware .. so ever since x-engine all these games and most unreal havok and some 3rd party engines were design with high assert gta5 perfect example. The game just has to be retooled to specific hardware architectures.
Its allways like this with crossgen platforms. And dev studio like to make profit to roll over to new projects. Take tomb raider. The remaster has helped fund the development of tomb raider rising.

And this time Microsoft plan on supporting 360 till 2016/17 with new games and I.p also .. people tell me to think of the early days of sega , they had the master system and megadrive/genesis sell side by side both platforms were very successful profitable the company...

New I.p are coming there is still 3 unannounced games coming to be announced. ... gdc/tgs

Busy busy day :)

One question people on the blog should ask them selves. If Microsoft had nothing hidden why all the NDA and black out media meeting about whats inside the xbox isn't that the biggest clue to all this.
Isnt it strange that devs are completely shocked with there new sdk. 10% does not give you double the performance alone. After today its clear now. :)
Mrc is 100% correct and on the right parth.. ether you have somebody on the inside or your really good at the numbers you sure know how to figure the clues. I know for everybody else it seem to complicated to connect the dots but you have it now..

June 2 2014. AMD and Microsoft presentation slide

Insider: Intresting conversation today. No apple employees are permitted in Microsoft nda events. Roumors are apple are definitely bring out an apple tv hybrid console.

There going to be doing self license gaming free sdk if you own an apple device.

People are going to wonder why I am bringing this up. Well it gives a clear picture to the Microsoft nda. Considering the apple designed soc is using licensed technology from other companies. Code name cyclone there is two technologys mobility and tv/console designed around this.. 22nm tech. 2.4 billion transistor fab. Strange to think the deal is reported to cost apple 1 billion usd. But then apple can fab the chip themselves. Sound strange to think one of these companies who they have licensed architecture from is Microsoft. And this chip will have 32mb esram too as spoken about today.

It is naive to think 5 billion transistors just for an apu
Consider the fact an i7 is 1.2 billion alone with gpu part. And that apple can fit esram on an soc and a 12 core cpu and two gpus and an arm A8 based accelerator and m8 coprocessor all in a 2.4 billion.

5 billion transistors. And the apple hybrid is reported to be near silent but pack 5 times the gpu and cpu performance of a ps3/360.

FPGA / DSP how much do they take up. Id like to see MRC do an analysis of ps4 transistor budget vs x1 vs apple A7 /8 soc with a diagrams xray shot of all three designs.. there is a big clue to how esram is used within two architectures.. and why the biggest clue should be submitted.

So much news yesterday and today. I could not believe the armed forces tactics involved in these presentation nda ... no date announced. Hate to be the other two guys walking into the room :)

Part 27. Remember X1 said as built from Supercomputer/Datacenter Architecture, ISCA 2014, Doug Burger Talk FPGA accelerator technology for Datacenter, Also 300 X1 devkit usage for machine learning
by Mistercteam


"Though FPGA technology is well understood and used widely in the embedded technology industry, it's rare to hear of it being paired with standard off-the-shelf CPUs for accelerating web-facing software – until now, that is.

"We're moving into an era of programmable hardware supporting programmable software," Microsoft Research's Doug Burger told The Register. "We're just starting down that road now."

If Microsoft has indeed figured out how to almost double the performance of its computers while only paying a tenth more in electricity for large-scale data center tasks – and we see no reason to doubt them – that's not only a huge saving, but also one that saves the company from the slowdown in run-of-the-mill CPUs chips.

"Based on the results, Bing will roll out FPGA-enhanced servers in one data center to process customer searches starting in early 2015," Derek Chiou, a principal architect of Bing, said in a statement emailed to El Reg.

"We were looking to make a big jump forward in data center capabilities. It's an important area," Microsoft Research's Doug Burger explained to us."

And Example of the performance is shown on Audio block
you looking at DSP/FPGA portion of it (same tech)


It is why they use Machine learning with 300 Devkit !!!!

Tensilica Reconfigurable logic / DPU / Same Tech MS used for
Audio Block, 1 Audio block is so small = 15.4 Gflop
what about 512-768 of it ?? (under half clock)


more later
interesting, register not said about the Main keynote "X1 tech insight" (NDA)
instead bring what Doug burger Reconfigurable logic
but most of tech user will probably know this is also
related to X1

like i said X1 tech will be for 2 targer the X1
also for Datacenter accelerator

Programming this thing is a nighmare
it is why only use for something specific

If MS could bring the tools to make C++ AMP
or like HSA , HSA also said will bring DSP/FPGA
then maybe this is a new era and X1 is first of its kind

X1 will bring local cloud (512-768 of it) + Data centre cloud
to talk as they are same tech building from gound up for future
workload .....

I believe MS modified the DPU of tensilica to use
MS own E2 reconfigurable logic of ALU part

And this is does not mean the Datacenter Doug burger
and X1 will same FPGA tech
but the underlying software development to support it
can be the same, X1 could use tensilica + E2
Datacenter could use pure E2 only FPGA (from MS research)

Register also the one that said X1 has Hybrid Memory cube
when MS join HMC Consortium
also the one hinted Mircosoft + ARM + AMD = FSA (HSA early version)

later on .....

Part 28. Dark Silicon /Breaking Moore's Law, to achieve it --> FPGA
by Mistercteam

Some example is Tensilica DPU the one that used on X1 audio block or infact it is on GPU too (later on)

Now lets take a look the DPU perforamcne from 45 nm of 2009

"Xtensa LX3 DPU offers the industry's widest range of pre-verified DSP options ranging from a simple floating point accelerator to a 16-MAC (multiply accumulator) vector DSP powerhouse. The base Xtensa LX3 DPU configuration can reach speeds of over 1 GHz in 45nm process technology (45GS) with an area of just 0.044 mm2 and power of 0.015 mW/MHz. When built with the new ConnX Baseband Engine DSP (ConnX BBE), the Xtensa LX3 processor delivers over 10 Giga-MACs-per-second performance, running at 625 MHz with a footprint of 0.93mm2 (post place-and-route 45GS) and consuming just 170 mW (including leakage)."

Let Raw calc a bit
10 GMAC = 5 Gflop ~ 0.93mm2 @ 45nm 170mW
5 Gflop , 170mW & @20/22nm = 0.25 mm2
30 Gflop, 1W @45nm !!!!!

basically Tensilica breaking 15 DP Gflop/watt using 45nm tech
Today GPU is only 10-15 SP Gflops/Watt not even DP !!!!

Let take a look at nvidia diagram below
they try to break > 15 DP Gflop barrier / watt

the problem with FPGA is they are harder than GPU
so MS have to be provide the framework & tools to support it
it is also why HSA also adopts DSP/FPGA not just CPU/GPU

generally, DSP/FPGA of X1 audio block for example
is just like PS3 Cell , a fusion of SIMD/vector and scalar

Part 29. To Sum it up, wattage, SIMD Processing, Audio block as hint, Insider said sometimes ago 0.45 clock(performance), all inline
by Mistercteam



Part 30. ARM inside Xbox One
by HernyFood

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